Notes and Queries, Number 04, November 24, 1849

[Antiquaries consider the mention of Cape Breton and Penguin Island as evidence. It cannot prove much, as the particulars were not committed to writing till about half-a-century after the voyage.]

"There is also another kinde of foule in that countrey [between the Gulf of Mexico and Cape Breton] … they have white heads, and therefore the country men call them penguins (which seemeth to be a Welsh nanme). And they have also in use divers other Welsh words, a matter worthy the noting."—The relation of David Ingram, 1568. in The principall navigations, etc. 1589. Fol.

[This narrative was compiled from answers to certain queries—perhaps twenty years after the events related.]

"Afterwards [anno 1669] they [The Doeg Indians] carried us to their town, and entertained us civilly for four months; and I did converse with them of many things in the British tongue, and did preach to them three times a week in the British tongue," etc. Rev. Morgan Jones, 1686.—British Remains, 1777. 8°.

[The editor omits to state how he procured the manuscript. The paper whence the above is extracted is either decisive of the question at issue, or a forgery.]

The student may infer, even from these imperfect hints, that I consider the subject which he proposes to himself as one which deserves a strict investigation—provided the collections hereafter described have ceased to be in existence.

"With respect to this extraordinary occurence in the history of Wales, I have collected a multitude of evidences, in conjunction with Edward Williams, the bard, to prove that Madog must have reached the American continent; for the descendants of him and his followers exist there as a nation to this day; and the present position of which is on the southern branches of the Missouri river, under the appellations of Padoucas, White Indians, Civilized Indians, and Welsh Indians."—William Owen, F.A.S. 1803.

The title prefixed to this paper would be a misnomer, if I did not add a list of books which it may be desirable to consult:—

On the Scandinavian discoveries.—Mémoires de la société royale des antiquaires du Nord. 1836-1839. Copenhague. 8°. p. 27.—Historia Vinlandiæ Antiquæ, seu partis Americæ septentrionalis—per Thormodum Terfæum. Haviniæ, 1705. 8°. 1715. 8°—Antiquitates Americanæ, sive scriptores septentrionales rerum Ante-Columbianarum in America. Hafniæ, 1837. 4°.

On the Welsh discoveries.—The historie of Cambria, now called Wales—continued by David Powel. London, 1584. 4°. The Myvyrian archaiology of Wales, London, 1801-7. 8°. 3 vol. British remains, by the Rev. N. Owen, A.M. London, 1777. 8°. The Cambrian biography, by William Owen, F.A.S. London, 1803. 8°. Biblithèque Américaine, par H. Ternaux. Paris, 1837. 8°. The principall navigations, voiages and discoveries of the English nation—by Richard Hakluyt, M.A. London, 1589. fol.

    BOLTON CORNEY.

MADOC—HIS EXPEDITION TO AMERICA

Dr. Plott, in his account, and Lord Monboddo, Origin and Progress of Language, refer to the Travels of Herbert (17th century), lib. iii. cap. ult., for a full history of this supposed discovery. They derived it from Meredyth ap Rhys, Gatty Owen, and Cynfyn ap Gronow, A.D. 1478-80. See also Atheneaum, Aug. 19. 1848.—Professor Elton's address at the meeting of the British Association, on this and the earlier Icelandic discovery.

The belief in the story has been lately renewed. See Archæologia Cambrens, 4. 65., and L'Acadie, by Sir J.E. Alexander, 1849. I will only observe that in Dr. Plott's account, Madoc was directed by the best compass, and this in 1170! See M'Culloch's Dictionary of Commerce.

    ANGLO-CAMBRIAN.

MADOC'S EXPEDITION

A traveller informs us that Baron A. von Humboldt urges further search after this expedition in the Welsh records. He thinks the passage is in the Examin Critique.

QUERIES

"CLOUDS" OR SHROUDS, IN SHAKESPEARE

I quite agree with your correspondent D.N.R., that there never has been an editor of Shakespeare capable of doing him full justice. I will go farther and say, that there never will be an editor capable of doing him any thing like justice. I am the most "modern editor" of Shakespeare, and I am the last to pretend that I am at all capable of doing him justice: I should be ashamed of myself if I entertained a notion so ridiculously presumptuous. What I intended was to do him all the justice in my power, and that I accomplished, however imperfectly. It struck me that the best mode of attempting to do him any justice was to take the utmost pains to restore his text to the state in which he left it; and give me leave, very humbly, to say that this is the chief recommendation of the edition I superintended through the press, having collated every line, syllable, and letter, with every known old copy. For this purpose I saw, consulted and compared every quarto and every folio impression in the British Museum, at Oxford, at Cambridge, in the libraries of the Duke of Devonshire and Lord Ellesmere, and in several private collections. If my edition have no other merit, I venture to assert that it has this. It was a work of great labour, but it was a work also of sincere love. It is my boast, and my only boast, that I have restored the text of Shakespeare, as nearly as possible, to the integrity of the old copies.

When your correspondent complains, therefore, that in "Hen. IV. Part 2," Act III. sc. 1., in the line,

"With deafening clamours in the slippery clouds,"

the word shrouds is not substituted by editors of Shakespeare for "clouds," the answer is, that not a single old copy warrants the merely fanciful emendation, and that it is not at all required by the sense of the passage. In the 4to of 1600, and in the folio of 1623, the word is "clouds;" and he must be a very bold editor (in my opinion little capable of doing justice to any author), who would substitute his own imaginary improvement, for what we have every reason to believe is the genuine text. Shrouds instead of "clouds" is a merely imaginary improvement, supported by no authority, and (as, indeed, your correspondent shows) without the merit of originality. I am for the text of Shakespeare as he left it, and as we find it in the most authentic representations of his mind and meaning.

    J. PAYNE COLLIER.

MEDAL OF THE PRETENDER

Sir,—Possibly some one of your literary correspondents, who may be versed in the, what D'Israeli would call Secret History of the Jacobite Court, will endeavour to answer a "Query" relative to the following rare medal:—

Obv. A ship of war bearing the French flag; on the shore a figure in the dress of a Jesuit (supposed to represent Father Petre) seated astride of a Lobster, holding in his arms the young Prince of Wales, who has a little windmill on his head. Legend: "Allons mon Prince, nous sommes en bon chemin." In the exergue, "Jacc: Franç: Eduard, supposé. 20 Juin, 1688."

Rev. A shield charged with a windmill, and surmounted by a Jesuit's bonnet; two rows of Beads or Rosaries, for an order or collar, within which we read "Honny soit qui non y pense;" a Lobster is suspended from the collar as a badge. Legend: "Les Armes et l'Ordre du pretendu Prince de Galles."

The difficulty in the above medal is the Lobster, though doubtless it had an allusion to some topic or scandal of the day; whoever can elucidate it will render good service to Medallic History, for hitherto it has baffled all commentators and collectors of medals. The windmill (indicative of the poplar fable that the Prince was the son of a miller), and the Roman Catholic symbols, are well understood.

There is an engraving of this medal in Van Loon's Histoire Metallique des Pays Bas. It is also imperfectly engraved in Edwards' Medallic History of England, for the Jesuit is represented kneeling on the shore, and Pinkerton, who furnished the text, calls it "a boy kneeling on the shore." The medal is so rare that probably the artist could obtain only a rubbed or mutilated impression to engrave from. My description is from a specimen, in my own collection, as fine as the day it was minted.

I may add that both Van Loon and Pinkerton have engraved the legend in the collar erroneously, "honi soit qui bon y pense;" it should be "non."

    B. NIGHTINGALE.

ROGER DE COVERLEY

In the Spectator's description of Sir Roger de Coverley it is said, "that his great-grandfather was the inventor of that famous country dance which is called after him." To the tune, as printed in Chappell's English Melodies, is appended a note to the effect that it was called after "Roger of Coverley" (Cowley, near Oxford).

Can any one inform me—

I. Where any notice of that Roger is to be found?

II. What is the etymon of "Cowley" (Temple Cowley and Church Cowley)?

III. If any notice of the tune is to be met with earlier than 1695, when it was printed by H. Playford in his Dancing Master?

    W.

HISTORY OF LANDED AND COMMERCIAL POLICY OF ENGLAND—HISTORY OF EDWARD II

Who was the author of the two following works?—"Remarks upon the History of the Landed and Commercial Policy of England, from the Invasion of the Romans to the Accession of James I. 2 vols. London: printed for E. Brooke, in Bell Yard, Temple Bar, MDCCLXXXV."

"The History of the Life, Reign, and Death of Edward II, King of England and Lord of Ireland, with the Rise and Fall of his great Favourites, Gaveston and the Spencers. Written by E.F. in the year 1627, and printed verbatim from the original. London: Printed by J.C. for Charles Harper, at the Flower-de-Luce in Fleet St.; Samuel Crouch, at the Princes' Arms, in Pope's head Alley in Cornhill; and Thomas Fox, at the Angel in Westminster Hall, 1680. (a portrait of Ed. II.)" In the 1st vol. Harl. Miscell. it is said that the above was found with the papers of the first Lord Falkland, and is attributed to him. My copy has Faulconbridge inserted in MS. over the F., and a book plate of Earl Verney, motto "Prodesse quam conspici," with an escutcheon of pretence.

    ANGLO-CAMBRIAN

THE REVEREND THOMAS LEMAN

Mr. Editor,—Amongst the later authorities on subjects of British-Roman antiquity, the Rev. Thomas Leman is constantly referred to, and in terms of great commendation.

Can you inform me whether that gentleman published any work or made an avowed communication of any of his researches? His name is not found in the Index to the Archæologia.

Mr. Leman contributed largely to Mr. Hatcher's edition of Richard of Cirencester; but it is one of the unsatisfactory circumstances of this work that these contributions, and whatever may have been derived from the late Bishop of Cloyne, are merely acknowledged in general terms, and are not distinguished as they occur.

I believe the MS. of the work was all in Mr. Hatcher's handwriting; some of your readers may possibly have the means of knowing in what way he used the materials thus given, or to what extent they were adapted or annotated by himself.

    A.T. Coleman Street, Nov. 13.

GOTHIC ARCHITECTURE